Introduction
GM Ju Wenjun has just won the 2025 FIDE Women’s World Chess Championship 6.5 to 2.5 against challenger GM Tan Zhongyi, successfully defending her title again. We had the chance to interview her after the match in Chongqing, China.
Questions asked by Lichess’ Theo Wait, with Lichess’ Yilin Li behind the camera and helping with translations when needed.
Video
Interview
Today we are very lucky to be joined by now the five times defending FIDE Women’s World Champion, GM Ju Wenjun, who is also the current Women’s Blitz Champion. GM Ju Wenjun, thank you so much for joining Lichess today. First of all, can we ask you, how does it feel to have won?
Oh, I feel very excited. Like, all the stress, when I become champion, when I win a match, all the stress is gone. All that is left is happiness and also some tiredness.
Does it ever change? Obviously you’ve got so much [World Championship] experience now. Does the feeling of happiness ever change? Is it a different sense of happiness?
Actually, it’s maybe varying in experience. It’s hard to describe, but I don’t think it’s changed.
So it’s always kind of the same level?
Yeah.
And you said something as well about the stress kind of melting away. It obviously must be such a pressured format. Can you describe a little bit about what the stress is like before the match?
For example, before the match, when I was training, I would have thoughts like: What if my opponent plays this move or plays that move. And there is also a lot of prep. During the game, I think it’s something you understand, that you need to just do it, to perform well. But this stress, it always comes with you. You cannot feel like it’s very easy. It’s not. It’s different [from other types of stress].
So, like a whole new level of pressure and stress? It was said about the Singapore World Championship match, for example, that a lot of what was decided there was based on psychology. Like at a certain point in the match format, it’s not necessarily the level of chess, it’s the psychological stability preparation. Would you say that’s also true for this match here as well?
You mean in Singapore?
Yeah, a lot of people said in Singapore it was down to stability. Do you think it’s the same story as here? It’s also the psychological stability, which is perhaps why you won this match.
I feel, for me, it’s okay. But for her [GM Tan Zhongyi] maybe something went wrong after game five. And her performance, it was just suddenly not her real performance, not her real level.
And there’s a very interesting element there as well, because you and your opponent, you’ve known each other for such a long time. And you’ve played against each other for so long. Obviously you’re professional athletes, so the personal aspect can be removed, but you know each other’s playing styles so well, you know each other’s personalities so well. How does that have an impact in a match like this?
To know your opponent so well is maybe more difficult than playing a new opponent, because she knows your style. So sometimes, you just cannot act on it very aggressively or something. I mean, she knows the real you. But for me — okay, this is also the same for her — her level is becoming stronger than ever, I think, especially in the last year.
She had a very strong performance in the Candidates, but you’ve also had an excellent year. Well, just over a year, you had a career best victory with GM Alireza Firouzja. You drew against the then open World Champion, GM Ding Liren, and you became Blitz World Champion. And now, for the fifth time, became World Champion here. So your form is also very impressive. In that year, with so many achievements, is this your crowning victory of the last 18 months or so, or is there something else you are more proud of?
I feel the most proud achievement is this match. Yeah. Because I feel I performed well, and also my team worked well, and also it’s a long match. So it’s really testing not only the chess, but also the mentality, the physicality and some energy, and stuff.
Yeah, stamina and stuff. On that element as well, that was an interesting point in Shanghai in one of the press conferences, how you highlighted that your upbringing kind of influences your chess style. Would you be able to elaborate a little bit more on that, on how you feel that your personality and background influenced your chess style?
I guess for chess players their personality is a little bit like their playing style. So I have maybe a more solid style, positional style, which means I usually feel no need to be very aggressive. I just feel what is natural.
The FIDE Women’s World Chess Champion 2025: GM Ju Wenjun.
Photo: Anna Shtourman / FIDE
Was there an element in this match as well, where because you know GM Tan Zhongyi’s style or personality so well, you perhaps knew she would play aggressively, overextend and you could perhaps wait for her to overextend a little bit?
I feel what I play in the game is just: Okay, this move, I like it. And also, I can maybe understand why I made this move. For her, I feel, actually, she is not as aggressive as in the previous match. So this time we are both more solid. I think literally every game ended up in an endgame. So, this time, I guess it’s more like patience and some technique. Yeah, some positional plays.
You showed really strong endgame technique, essentially every single game. So, definitely a very solid style. Talking a bit about that, you mentioned a few minutes ago about your team. You’ve mentioned that you’re working with GM Ni Hua, GM Maxim Matlakov, and WGM Wang Pin.
Yes.
How did this team come about? How long have you been collaborating with each other?
So, for Ni Hua, we started working together since 2016. And, for every match, I won this title, and he was always a coach of my team. And okay, he is also my colleague in Shanghai, and Wang Pin as well. So we have known each other for a long, long, long time. For Maxim, we started working in the last year, and he gave some advice during tournaments, also some training sessions. So I think we have a good team, and they collaborate well.
The result here, of course, shows it’s a good team and that they collaborate well. A lot of people often think chess at the elite level is maybe quite lonely. But could you discuss a little bit about how much time you spent working together, like how many hours of work and preparation it takes to do a match like this?
Well, I think maybe before the match, it was kind of a massive work. In general, from morning maybe to before dinner. Some break hours. But it’s a massive amount of work. And I think during the match, actually, they did the big work. They analyze things so much whenever they have time. I also work some, but not as much as before the tournament.
Makes sense. And how many hours a day? Potentially 12 hours a day?
Oh no, not that much.
But several hours a day of work?
Okay, sometimes. I didn’t really check. Sometimes you feel tired and you just take a pause.
And there was an interesting moment as well yesterday in the press conference where you mentioned with WGM Wang Pin that she also at times seemed to like comfort you, if you were finding some pressures. Could you elaborate on that?
Yes, okay. She can accompany me a lot of the time when I’m not playing chess. And also she used to be on the Chinese national team, she won this Olympic gold medal for China. So she has a lot of experience as a chess player. She gives me some advice and she can also buy me some fruits. And she also helps me to relax.
Sometimes, even after some of your wins, you didn’t seem particularly happy afterwards.
Well, yes, I think this is kind of a habit. Maybe not so great. But for me, I don’t feel that because the tournament is still going on, so I don’t feel that it’s time to be happy yet.
This is part of your psychological stability you were talking about, you just focus on what’s ahead of you. Just on the games.
Yes, I guess I was. When I was in the press conferences, I was still focused on the games.
it’s a great way to be very reliable and strong. This is the second time, now that you’ve played GM Tan Zhongyi — well, in a match format — do you feel like there’s any kind of difference from the first time compared to the second time?
Yeah, I think from the first time, she is more aggressive. And also, that time, I was a challenger and she was the champion. So for me it was like I’m not totally new, but maybe I wasn’t so familiar with the match format. But I think after these seven or eight years we both grew up and grew stronger. She also had a very successful career in the last year. But this time I feel maybe she prepared well and she played well. But after maybe round five or something, it was just not going so well for her.
GM Ju Wenjun is crowned the Women’s World Chess Champion for the fifth time.
Photo: Anna Shtourman / FIDE
Some people online were likening it to Carlsen vs. Nepomniachtchi, in the way that you were quite strong, stable, positional, and sometimes Tan was a bit like Nepo, maybe kind of thinking about her mistakes after she had made them.
Well, actually I have no idea. Sometimes I understand that maybe she should be much better than what she performed, but maybe she has some, you know, some stress, and also something that stuck with her.
A different way of handling the pressure. It was interesting there as well, you mentioned that you felt she was very well prepared in the opening, and she also said this yesterday in the press conference, that she felt her opening preparation was good. If you had to rate both of your levels on a scale of 1 to 10 in this match – in opening, middlegame, endgame – What kind of grades would you give for yourself and for Tan?
I think in general we’re at about a similar level, but in endgames I was slightly better. And also I think Tan Zhongyi is just not showing her true level. So I think maybe I would give an eight for all, but maybe a nine in the endgame for me, and eight something for her.
Or maybe you’re being humble, here! Your endgame was maybe stronger than that. There were, essentially, no inaccuracies by you in the endgames. So very, very strong play. We also wanted to touch on something else. In an interview online with the South China Post, you said that you find the idea of having a fifth title defense very motivating. Do you find the idea of a sixth title defense motivating as well?
Well, this question is too early. It’s too early. Yeah. I mean right now I want to really just have a moment to relax and then to think. Because everything is like maybe one or two years away. So yeah, it’s still too soon to tell.
Some other world champions have recently walked away — would you walk away from defending the title or would you always want to defend the title?
Actually, I feel like I just try to enjoy this match, so it doesn’t matter — defending or something. But I just try to play the match and try to maybe focus on performing better than the opponent.
Looking to the future as well. There’s obviously a lot of very strong players coming up. Are there any particular players you have your eye on that you’d like to play in a match format?
Okay, not in particular, but I think if someone qualifies, then she will be very motivated and very strong.
So you’ll play whoever, whoever you’ve got next.
Yeah.
Obviously, one name that has to be mentioned is WGM/IM Lu Mioayi, who’s rising very quickly and is a very strong young player. GM Levon Aronian and GM Magnus Carlsen in the past have said that they like beating the younger generation early, so that they learn to fear facing that older player again. Do you subscribe to this mentality as well?
I understand this strategy. Yeah, I understand. But I feel I’m not that kind of strategy person. I just feel like if I do play her, then I will try to probably play for a win, but maybe not beat her just because someone is young or something.
You won’t purposefully try to do it. Just if the opportunity is there. And just now that the match is over, have you got some thoughts on how you’re going to spend the time relaxing?
Yes, for relaxing, I think after the tournament, after dinner, I will just go have a walk and then not too long, just like 20 minutes or something, just to relax and have some fresh air.
GM Ju Wenjun holding her trophy at the Closing Ceremony.
Photo: Anna Shtourman / FIDE
And any plans coming up. You’ve got this new tournament coming up as well, right? The National Intellectual Games quite soon.
Yeah. It’s, it’s some qualification for these national games. And also before that, I have this Norway Chess.
So not much time to rest.
Actually, no, not much. Not much.
No rest for the wicked, as they say. And just very quickly. Do you have any interests outside of chess as well? Any hobbies?
Very few hobbies. Maybe coffee.
And you say you like listening to music as well?
Yeah, yeah, music also. But I mean to say that this is an interest, is kind of — maybe you don’t have many interests.
So do you do karaoke sometimes too?
Karaoke? I don’t do that anymore.
Oh, okay. Oh — anymore. Did you just say you didn’t do it anymore?
Yes. I think when I was quite young, I did some karaoke. But now I don’t have that much time.
Of course, yes. Thank you so much for joining us today, Ju Wenjun, and congratulations on the trophy and the wonderful victory. It’s a real pleasure to speak with you. Thank you so much.
Thank you very much. Thank you.